Lead warning for Titanium White??

Ant Carlos · 05-28-2005, 11:44 AM

Dear Richard and Garth,

What confuses me is that the previous tube of Titanium White I had purchased doesn't have any warning (see in the photo). Why this? Should be the same product, same pigments, same vehicle, and, what is more important, AS SAFE!
Maybe only W&N could clarify this.

As for tinting, I did not test it yet, but I put some of my tit and led based whites in my palette to compare.
The photo show 9 whites, and I numbered them and took closer shots:
1- It's from my old 200ml tube of W&N Titanium White, that has no lead warning label. Actually, it says NON TOXIC. It's a cool white, opaque as Tit should be.
2- This is from the new 200ml tube, that brings the lead-warning label. It looks a bit warmer indeed (only if you look very carefully), and glossier. It's hard to say if the difference is on the vehicle or the pigment. I come to no conclusion about the lead. I should contact W&N, to satisfy my curiosity.

Ant

Garth Herrick · 05-28-2005, 12:03 PM

Dear Ant,

We should petition for a Forum subsection just devoted to photo-documented side by side comparison of paints!

Anyway the two tubes of paint have the same bar code, but different ratings of permanence. Do these two whites tint the same when mixed with the same color?

Garth

Garth Herrick · 05-28-2005, 12:29 PM

Here is a much older, but never used tube of your white, for comparison and history:

Ant Carlos · 05-28-2005, 12:27 PM

Since I have displayed more whites side by side, I'll continue with the comparison and share this with you:
3- Titanium W by a very popular Brazilian brand. It's cheap, but it's OK for experiments. It's warmer than both W&N (#1 and #2 in the previous post) and very glossy and buttery. I don't like it.
4- Tit W by Maimeri. The coolest of all. Very glossy too, very opaque. Like the #3, it's not of my favorites.
5- Tit W by Talens-Rembrandt. It

Ant Carlos · 05-28-2005, 12:49 PM

Garth,

I did not notice the different ratings of permanence before. Hmmm.
And they do tint differently as well. Mixed with cerulean Blue, a very strong color, the 2nd white did not show too shy. What do you think? Lead? If yes, then why didn't W&N simply add Lead Carbonate (PW1) in the pigments list?
I agree about the foto-documented forum

And it seems I posted this topic in the wrong forum, eh.. I didn't see the forum about paints-brushed before

Anyway, thank you for helping me on this.

Ant

Garth Herrick · 05-28-2005, 01:03 PM

Ant,

Did you see my over-the-top reply to Richard Budig's thread on Indian Red and Terra Rosa? I posted it yesterday. More info than you would ever want to know!

http://forum.portraitartist.com/showthread.php?t=5867

A warm color like Terra Rosa can be a good indicator of what is in the white. As you know, lead/flake white makes a much warmer tint than Titanium/Zinc does.

Garth

Ant Carlos · 05-29-2005, 11:11 AM

Hi Garth,

I read your reply to Richard. You did a very good job going into all those tests w/ images. Great info.

So I picked a Brown Earth and tested my whites' tinting. Flake White tints the warmer, indeed. But still I could come to no conclusion about the WN Warning label in the 2nd Tube of Tit White. It does seem to tint slightly warmer, but nothing of significance. Maybe only a difference in the vehicles, or, like you said, one tube to another. Where is the lead? You said they perhaps are milled in the same machinery as Cremnitz and Flake White, that's a possibility.

The pics bellow show my experiment. I used a Brazilian Brown Earth (which they named Sombra Queimada, translated "Burnt Umber" but we can see clearly that it has nothing to do with the Umbers we know). It almost matches the color of my wooden palette (made from Ip