Need advice on priming board

Tito Champena · 09-06-2002, 07:43 PM

I am the one who is planning to paint a portrait of his granddaughter, using the verdaccio and glazes technique. I have purchased a wonderful piece of hardboard that has been primed with linseed oil and Zinc White. However, because it does not look white enough for my purpose, I'm planning to apply a second layer of priming but using Flake White instead of Zinc White. I'm asking for advice now because I don't want my granddaughter complaining 60 years from now, that her portrait has just peeled off from the hardboard.

This is the way I plan to proceed:

1. I intend to use Flake White in linseed oil because acrylic gesso will not stick to a surface that has been primed with an oil paint.

2. Before applying the Flake White I will spread a thin film of linseed or walnut oil on the surface to improve the adhesion.

3. I will use turpentine, not oil as a medium, in order to comply with "fat over lean" rule.

4. I will not start painting until the Flake White layer is completely dry. (Incidentally, how long will it take to dry?)

Michael Fournier · 09-06-2002, 08:04 PM

Not that I am trying to be a wise guy, but my advice would be to get a new piece of hardboard and use gesso. The cost of hardboard is not that much. If you want a smooth surface, sand between coats. Or you can even buy pre-primed panels or clay board. In the end it will make your life easier. Painting is hard enough as it is. Why complicate it further with all that prep work and having to wait for an oil base primer to dry?

Karin Wells · 10-26-2002, 05:18 PM

For starters I would not use turpentine as a medium for oil paint except to sketch with in the very first layer.

If your surface is not "white" enough, you might consider using an oil primer instead of flake white. I know that Winsor-Newton makes one but by nature, "oil" has a color.

If you really want a stark white ground, I would suggest that you get another hardboard that has an acrylic gesso primer.

A layer of flake white will leave brush strokes and do you really want that as a first layer? Also, if you sand this layer to smooth it out, you would have to be extremely careful as flake white has lead in it and you shouldn't let that become airborne.

The Old Masters and most of the painters that I know prefer to begin a portrait on a toned canvas.

Tito Champena · 10-27-2002, 09:59 AM

Thank you Karin for your advice, I appreciate it.

Michael Georges · 10-27-2002, 11:54 AM

Tito:

I am wondering where you got the zinc white board. An oil ground is wonderful to paint on.

That said, I don't do it very often. As Michael said, it is a lot of work, and it is messy and you have to be pretty careful to do it right.

There are a number of commercially available oil priming products available on the market that will work in a similiar fashion. I might recommend you check those out before you dive into coating the board with Flake White.

Or, you can indeed put a coat or coats of Flake White over it, but I would recommend you go very minimal on the linseed oil. After all, you are looking for the benefits of a lead white ground - don't oil it up too much or your ground will become too fat.

I think that if you waited for at least two weeks before beginning your painting, that should be sufficient time for the lead ground to setup sufficiently. Scrub it in thin with multiple coats rather than thick with fewer coats. Dry it and then wet sand it inbetween coats - use wet/dry sandpaper - sand it wet, and then dry the board with disposable towels. The water will keep the dust from getting into the air. Wash your hands, area and tools used very carefully after each sanding. When it is done, let it dry for a day or two and then buff it to an ivory sheen with a soft cloth. Let it cure for two weeks (my opinion - others may say up to 6 months) before beginning your painting.

Tito Champena · 10-27-2002, 01:46 PM

Than you, Michael, for you advice, but I think I will try the board as is without any modification, because any alteration might not be satisfactory.

Really, I always tone down the canvas when I paint "alla prima", but I thought that when you use an underpainting and transparent glazes you want the white of the support to shine through the various layers of color. The Impressionists who did not paint with glazes used a white canvas primed with flake white. However the Great Masters who painted with glazes, used to tone their canvas. So that's why it's a little confusing for me.

Karin Wells · 10-27-2002, 06:09 PM

Quote:

but I thought that when you use an underpainting and transparent glazes you want the white of the support to shine through the various layers of color.

Actually, this is not the principal behind underpainting. What shows through naturally are the halftones. The areas of light are "built up" by thicker layers of opaque paint that cover what is beneath.

Tito Champena · 10-27-2002, 07:32 PM

Thank you for the explanation Karin, I understand now why Renoir painted the lights very thin because he was using the white of the canvas as his light, something completely opposite of Rembrandnt's technique that was in accordance to the classic principles that you describe. I think the painting on the hard board that I have is going to be all right without having to make it whiter. Only in this Forum one can ask an experience painter for advice before making costly mistakes. Thank you all for taking the time to answer my silly question.

Timothy C. Tyler · 10-31-2002, 10:02 PM

Tito,

Michael's on the right path. You've heard the adage "fat over lean"? Well, by starting with a fat base (per your description) there's nowhere to go but very fat from then on. Otherwise what WILL happen in less than 60 years is the new paint will crack off.

As far as how white your base, who cares? You're about to go grey with everything before going to the final colors anyway right? Thick rich color doesn't care how white the very base is anyway, no matter what you read. Thick opaque pigment painted over grey underpainting will not reflect how white you started.

Jeremiah White · 11-01-2002, 01:29 AM

Quote:

As far as how white your base, who cares? You're about to go grey with everything before going to the final colors anyway right? Thick rich color doesn't care how white the very base is anyway, no matter what you read. Thick opaque pigment painted over grey underpainting will not reflect how white you started.

I agree completely and was thinking that myself when reading this.