Do you size Masonite?

[Gary Hoff]

I don't post here much (more to read than I can cover) but anyway....

First, I think they don't make Masonite any more--that's a brand name--but there are several companies that make compressed hardboard that is similar to it. Unfortunately, there seems to be a very wide variation in how hard the hardboard actually is.

Next, it's not clear to me if you're using traditional gesso or acrylic primer that's sold under that name. My guess is you're using the acrylic stuff. Real gesso is made with whiting and glue (traditionally rabbit skin glue or today sometimes other kinds) and is often made by mixing various proportions of the powdered ingredients in water. Acrylic "gesso" is dilutable in water, too, of course, and in my experience, the water soaks into the hardboard and will bring up the brown stains you've seen. On the other hand, real gesso hasn't done that for me, probably because of the glue. Some experts recommend that you give the panel a drink of diluted glue solution before applying traditional gesso. I'd guess that's why traditional gesso doesn't bring up the brown stains.

Sanding the smooth side of the hardboard is actually a good idea when priming it because it increases the mechanical bonding of the primer to the wood--I use 120 grit paper. It doesn't require a great deal of sanding, btw--barely enough to rough up the surface. You don't have to do it, but when using traditional gesso, sanding is a good idea. Most who prepare their own gessoed panels sand between coats as well, and may apply as many as six coats (usually at least three).

I don't know if this is helpful or not, so if not, then "never mind."

Oh, and if you don't want to go to the trouble of doing it yourself, you can get some lovely prepared panels from http://www.realgesso.com/

[Jen Reinstadler]

Thanks, Gary! Nobody ever explained the difference between real gesso and the acrylic primer. Of course, I've had a salesman at a supply store strongly recommend Golden's over the cheaper generic brand, but he failed to tell me exactly why it was so much better...and more expensive. Perhaps he didn't really know himself.

And you're right about Masonite. It's simply called hardboard now. I called three lumber yards, none of them carried "Masonite." But at least one customer service guy knew what I needed!

[Gary Hoff]

Originally Posted by Jen Reinstadler

Thanks, Gary! Nobody ever explained the difference between real gesso and the acrylic primer. Of course, I've had a salesman at a supply store strongly recommend Golden's over the cheaper generic brand, but he failed to tell me exactly why it was so much better...and more expensive. Perhaps he didn't really know himself.....

You're very welcome.

Yes I'm afraid that a great many art store employees know more about how to run the cash register than they do about the materials they sell. If you'd like to try traditional gesso, you can order some pretty inexpensively from Studio Products at www.studioproducts.com

[Richard Budig]

Gary:

Sorry . . . I use "gesso" without defining which one. I use the acrylic version since it is easier (IMHO) to deal with. Little or now mixing, etc.

In my recent "trail," I've been using straight out of the tub, thick and gooey, and that infernal hardboard (the rough side) just keeps slurping it down. Not going to do that anymore.

[Allan Rahbek]

Originally Posted by Richard Budig

Gary:

Sorry . . . I use "gesso" without defining which one. I use the acrylic version since it is easier (IMHO) to deal with. Little or now mixing, etc.

In my recent "trail," I've been using straight out of the tub, thick and gooey, and that infernal hardboard (the rough side) just keeps slurping it down. Not going to do that anymore.

I have used the Acrylic Gesso for some canvases. After sizeing with Animal glue (bone ) 2 times and a light sanding I gessoed 2 times. When I use such a canvas I like to oil it over from the start.

You can use Animal Skin Glue, Acrylic binder or even Linseed Oil with White spirit if you let it dry well before gessoing on Masonite. I never use the rough side.

The Acrylic Gesso is best for canvas because of the flexibility of Acrylic binder. If you prefer traditional Gesso be sure to make it an Oil, Egg and Glue Gesso.

Allan

[Lisa Ober]

Originally Posted by Allan Rahbek

When I use such a canvas I like to oil it over from the start.

That is an excellent idea! I find that gesso on any board is quite thirsty. Oiling out before painting is a fantastic solution to that problem.

On another note, I like to use MDF instead of masonite (hardboard). You won't have the problem with those fine fibers on the sides (where the board was cut) soaking up moisture. That problem is much like getting window cleaner under a glass tabletop. It's impossible to eliminate. With MDF, the composite is consistent throughout and fairly stable. It weighs a bit more but is available in 1/4" thickness which isn't too bad.

I know that doesn't exactly fit the original question but it's a thought to consider.

[Sharon Knettell]

A while ago, I had a long talk with Micheal Harding the English paint maker. He said MDF board was the most stable paint surface available. It really does not need any sizing, just paint on it. I use it for my large pastels. Just give it a light sanding to make the paint adhere better.

No gesso, no nothing. Simple and archival.

[Allan Rahbek]

Originally Posted by Lisa Ober

You won't have the problem with those fine fibers on the sides (where the board was cut) soaking up moisture. .

It is important to cut the board from the right side to avoid loose fibers on the front side.
The side that is to be the front have to be upside when cutting it with a handheld saw so that the teeth will cut from the front and only rip up the fibers on the backside.
If you cut with a handheld circular saw it must be cut from the back of cause.

Allan