Marriage of ceremonies

Cynthia Feustel · 05-01-2005, 04:48 PM

I currently have a commission for an oil portrait of a couple's wedding. They were married in the '80's and had two ceremonies. The wife is American and the husband is Indian. They had an Indian ceremony and the next day a traditional church wedding. The painting is a surprise gift for her husband.

Here is where my dilemma begins. First of all, the American wedding ceremony was documented by a professional photographer but apparently he did not do a very good job as I had a hard time finding any photos in her album really worthy to paint. She wore a gown with big, puffy sleeves ( very in style in the 1980's) which she does not like. She wants the sleeves smaller. I found an exceptable photo where her husband's hand is holding down the sleeve (front views were awful). Also they are not smiling which is good.

I was also given some snapshots of the Indian ceremony. These were more interesting, full of color and patterns, but no one got a photo of the bride and groom together or any good pictures of the groom without his face veiled.

I would love to "marry" these two ceremonies together into one painting. I am thinking about using the American photo and replacing the curtain behind them with fabric or a symbol or Indian words or something that would represent the Indian ceremony.

Any advice or suggestions are enormously appreciated. Here is a website that I found that has some symbols/words. I just don't know what they say.
http://www.indianweddingcard.com/sym...kh_symbols.htm
I don't think the wife can be much help on this unless she can contact some of the relatives to help translate. And what is sikh? I am going to call the wife but I am trying to gather my thoughts and questions together first.

Thanks!
Cynthia
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Marcus Lim · 05-01-2005, 10:15 PM

Hi Cynthia,

I realize the dilemma and frustration you must be feeling right now. Indeed, this is not an easy task, even for me as an Asian.

But just to contribute an idea, I'm now working on a near-posthumous painting of a lady, who wanted to be remembered in a certain manner. The point about her wanting to be dressed sexily, and admiring butterflies needs to be touched on sensitively! So what
I do is, to base on current photographs, and find some clothing references that can fit her and still make her look good. In the end, I managed to find somewhat of a nightie that reminds me of the models in William Whitaker's paintings (dunnowhatyoumaycallit!

)
So with her pose, and my pencils, I started to draw her with that outfit first! So now, it turned out well (though I haven't showed her yet) but with this drawing, I can later use it as my guide for the full painting!

Oh by the way, Sikhs are also known as Punjabs, from the Indian(?) state of Punjabis...those who wear turbans...so what you can look at are infos on punjabi wedding customs. I'm sure there are lots of descriptions on the web and books. Hope this is helpful to you.

Allan Rahbek · 05-02-2005, 12:22 PM

Cynthia,

Since this is a surprise present to the husband I would suggest to make a fine portrait of his beautiful bride in the Indian dress. With a little more space around her, especially on top and bottom and without the hands. Just a simple portrait of the head and dress.

Allan

Cynthia Feustel · 05-02-2005, 05:04 PM

Marcus and Allan, thanks so much for your replies.

I agree with you Allan . I think the close up would make an interesting painting. After seeing that photo it was hard to want to paint from the other reference which is rather drab in comparison. I thought I could perhaps liven it up a bit by adding something ethnic in the background. We looked around her house for some item or fabric to use in the painting but she didn't really have anything there. That is when I started my search on the internet. That only confused me more because I didn't know if it made a difference what part of India her husband was from and I couldn't even pronounce some of the words. Marcus, thanks for the info on Punjabi .

I did a search on the SOG site for bridal and found a painting by Kathy Coates that illustrates my idea for some type of Indian fabric/wall hanging or design in the background. Also there are some symbols that I found via the internet which might work.

I think I will do some sketches and present them to the client so she can see what I am thinking. When we initially talked she seemed interested in hearing about other options and liked the idea of more color or using the Indian ceremony in some way. She actually said that they enjoyed that wedding more than the other one. Maybe I can sell her on the single portrait idea.

I need to get this settled soon. I just found out that I may have a tear in my rotator cuff on my right shoulder (yes, I'm right handed

). I just started physical therapy and am waiting to hear if I need surgery. They are telling me that the recovery is almost 3 months!!
I have a lot of commissions that I am already committed to do. I just stopped most of my art classes that I teach so that I could really go full speed ahead with portraits and now this. Also my daughter is graduating high school this month and then I'll have two in college, OUCH. I need income. I need my shoulder. Opps! Sorry , I got off the subject a bit.

I will try to get a drawing or something in photoshop to post. As far as the quality of the photos does anyone have any comments?

Thanks again,

Cynthia

Chris Saper · 05-02-2005, 08:42 PM

Cynthia,

So sorry to hear about your shoulder!

Regarding your portrait commission, I think your client has some unrealistic expectations. As a surprise gift, I think it is a better idea to just paint a single subject - her.

Do you know why she wants a wedding picture from the 80's to serve as a source? Does she still have her Indian wedding dress? Why not ask her to pose for you to take the photos, her in her gown? It could be sort of like a "renewal of vows" concept - the present day woman, the nostalgia of the wedding dress. Certainly the close up show a beautiful woman with a great expression - but it's taken with a flash.

Michele Rushworth · 05-02-2005, 10:17 PM

I agree wholeheartedly with Chris' s suggestion that you take new photos of the bride alone. (Review the threads on how to take great portrait reference photos.) Then work with her to pick just one of them to paint from. It's virtually impossible to make a good portrait by cobbling together widely divergent reference photos.

Kimberly Dow · 05-04-2005, 02:01 PM

I'm drooling over that fabric. I'd love to paint that!

Allan Rahbek · 05-04-2005, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kimberly Dow

I'm drooling over that fabric. I'd love to paint that!

Me too.

You could settle on wholesale and forget about the shoulder, Cynthia.

Allan

Cynthia Feustel · 05-05-2005, 01:17 AM

Quote:

Do you know why she wants a wedding picture from the 80's to serve as a source? Does she still have her Indian wedding dress? Why not ask her to pose for you to take the photos, her in her gown? It could be sort of like a "renewal of vows" concept - the present day woman, the nostalgia of the wedding dress. Certainly the close up show a beautiful woman with a great expression - but it's taken with a flash.

Chris, thanks for the suggestions.
The wedding ceremonies were back to back, two days in a row. The wedding pictures of the second ceremony show them with huge bags under their eyes. I know how I felt after just one wedding day! The photographer did some retouching and they ended up with orange streaks under their eyes. The picture looked so bad she threw it away. I feel that she just really wants a momento of the actual wedding. On the photo I posted I removed the bags(under eyes) in Photoshop.

When artists paint posthumous portraits they often have to work with poor quality photos. This may just be the case here. I teach both of her daughters art and her husband (who is a doctor) may be joining the adult class as his schedule permits. They have some poor quality photo enlargements (18" x 24") taken from snapshots of their two beautiful daughters framed and hanging in their home . I am hoping that if I give her what she wants she may also decide on portraits of the girls (which I could photograph). I also hope to sell her on the idea of the close up in the Indian dress too. Boy, am I ever dreaming but maybe wishful thinking will pay off!

Thanks Michele too! I need all of your encouragement. It is no joke when I say that I work from the worlds worse references. I have been painting portraits (watercolor) for 6-7 years and until November. when I found this forum I never realized that I didn't have to be accepting these poor quality photos. I can't tell you how frustrated I have been at times. One of these days I'll post the nightmare that I am working on now in watercolor. You will either laugh and say "that lady is crazy" or you'll have such pity on me you'll cry and say "that poor lady IS crazy!". I'll just keep you in suspense for now. I have a few of these commissions that I have already agreed to do but I will be more selective with my references from now on.

I have only been posting for a short time but I can't tell you what a life saver this forum is for me. I soooooo want to move on to the next level with my art. Your support is more than appreciated!

Cynthia