Rembrandt's sparkle effect - Page 4

Michael Georges · 05-08-2002, 09:27 AM

Marble dust is also an age old additive in oil painting. The difference from what I have seen here however, is that most added the marble dust to their oil ground, not in the oil paint layers. That said, Karin if you decide to try some added to your whites, then be aware that it will add a body to the paint, but use it sparingly as it is very absorbent and too much will likely cause brittleness and cracks down the road. And depending on how fine it is ground, the same should go for the quartz powder.

I use a gesso that has marble dust added to it. It is like painting on hydrastone. You can build up impasto effects with it at the charcoal stage and have no fear of cracks down the road. You can sand it, carve it....works great for me.

As for the book mentioned on Rembrandt. I have it and it is a really great book. It wouldn't surprise me if he did add quartz powder, like any painter, he seemed to experiment a lot. But the point is, he certainly didn't need it. I agree with Karin that proper rendering in plain'ol oil paint is sufficient.

Karin Wells · 05-08-2002, 11:31 AM

Michael:

Still haven't gotten around to trying the marble dust. Do you have any suggestions as to how much to add....30% maybe?

I'm looking to build up a thick impasto...

Rochelle:

Please HELP us out here...I wish to find the important "Rembrandt" reference that you have referred to where he added stuff to his paint. There is sooooo much on the reference site that you gave us that it could take me days/weeks to find it with my 56K dial up modem...if it really is there that you found the information.

Michael Georges · 05-08-2002, 12:12 PM

Karin:

To my gesso, I use a golden mean ratio - 1 part marble dust to 1.6 parts gesso.

If you were to use it in actual paints, then I think that following the generally accepted 20/80 ratio that is used for mediums - 20% marble dust to 80% paint might work out ok. I know you already know to try it on a test panel first.

Many of the thick impasto effects we see in old master works, I believe, were likely built up over repeated applications during a number of months. If you just apply an impasto layer directly and it is thick, then you risk cracking as the top layer will dry while the underside will take several months if not a year or more to dry. When it does, and over time, it will contract - at a different rate than the top layer - and it is almost inevitable that cracks will result.

Now, the addition of a dryer such as liquin to this mix might help mitigate the risk of cracks as the layers will dry faster, but I still would be tempted to apply several times to ensure that things below were dry - my opinion.

Hope that helps.

Rochelle Brown · 05-08-2002, 03:56 PM

Cynthia,
You've saved the day again!

Karin and others,
It may be worth the while to have the book by Ernest Van Wetering "Rembrandt the Painter at Work", which was mentioned at the beginning of this thread. It used to be $80 but now they can be found used for $21 on Amazon. There will be clear pictures and documentation of the added quartz and glass and all of their findings. I have ordered another book called "Rembrandt the Master in his Workshop" which is out of print and available used.

Michael,
Do you know how fine these powders should be and do you know anything about other types of powders? It would be very helpful to know this.

Thanks all, Rochelle

Michael Georges · 05-08-2002, 04:09 PM

Sorry Rochelle, I don't really know about how fine the powders need to be. My experience with the marble dust is that it creates a very absorbent ground - thereby I can extrapolate that most such powders will cause a certain amount of oil absorbtion. It sound like a great experiment to me, so if you have a chance to do it, please let the rest of us know what you find.

Hey, you don't suppose that they ground the powdered pigments in a quartz mortar and pestle do you? Could that be the source of the quartz in the paint? Also, how about the muller he used? Was it stone or glass? Could it be the source of the minerals in the paint? We may never know for sure....

Rochelle Brown · 05-08-2002, 04:10 PM

All of this posting has been very time consuming. I have hardly time to wash the dishes and I still have to photograph and frame my latest portrait for a man who wanted a painting of his deceased wife. There is a local high quality photo lab who will put this on a jpeg for me. Maybe I will be able to get it onto the portrait critiques. Perhaps you will even like it. Sigh.

By the way Happy Mother's Day to all the Moms!
I'm getting my mom the latest Celine Dion CD.

Rochelle Brown · 05-08-2002, 04:16 PM

Michael you are a fast poster. Anyway it may be of interest to see this page: www.jcsparks.com/painted/pigment_print.html if I got it right that is.

Michael Georges · 05-09-2002, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Michael you are a fast poster. Anyway it may be of interest to see this page: www.jcsparks.com/painted/pigment_print.html if I got it right that is.

Rochelle:

Thanks for the link! I printed it, bound it, and added it to my library under P for pigments.