Justifiable aversion to art shows

[Lon Haverly]

I am happy to contribute to the religious references. Of course, Jesus said He was the Way, the Truth and the Life, and yes, the gospel He preached was a very narrow way. But His message was one of love and redemption for those who believe, and I have experienced the reality of that love since I chose to believe the gospel many years ago, and that has been the guiding factor all my life. You might say that I am a Jesus freak. I am not ashamed of my faith. I do not demand that you believe the gospel, even if you ARE condemned if you don't! It is your choice! You of course have heard it all, so no need to elaborate. I reserve that for those who believe.

Art is nothing like faith. There are many ways to be an artist. I am happy that I learned some of the fundamentals of art as a child in private art school where the fundamentals were taught plain and simple. If I had waited until I got to college, I would likely not have learned them at all amongst all the liberal clutter of higher "education."

[Timothy C. Tyler]

Lon, I beg to differ. Religon is faith based, which means people feel or think (believe) they are right. The truth is people not of your faith feel the same way. Buddists feel their way is right.

Get a FUD from a university in art and you WILL feel and think that abstract art is the only and BEST way wise and learned people paint.

During the civil war someone asked Lincoln, "Do you think God is on our side?" Lincoln said,"In every great conflict of humanity both sides always say God is on their side. Both sides may be, and one side must be, wrong! I only hope we are on his side."

[Tammy Nielsen]

Free Choice, the great gift of life, religion and art. Great discussion guys!

We are given the gift of choice which gives us a ticket to get on the great bus of truth, and we can continue on the bus until we have all truth; or we can get off and explore that with which we feel comfortable, or all the truth we can bear and understand. Or we can get back on and continue from one truth to another.

We can persuade others to come with us, etc., but just as science at one point or another thinks it has encompassed all truth, only to be dashed when they realize that what they thought was true wasn't, they have to get back on the bus again and reevaluate the past. Just some thoughts of mine.

Tammy

[Cynthia Daniel]

This thread is getting off the original topic.

[Elizabeth Schott]

Ahaaaa, my intention to lighten this up did not work, nor did it bring it back to the topic of judging at art shows.

But I must say two things here...

This site is filled with people who were denied anything approaching a thorough education in art school.

I believe this could be said about any type of education received, bad teacher or students not absorbing the whole. There are those who excelled and those who got by. There is the casual weekend artist and the serious professional. I am sure the portrait painter is frowned upon by the "abstract" painter, as the acrylic, pastel portrait artist is likely frowned upon by the "oil" painter. Is this solely a matter of education?

Who are we to decide and judge? Some choose personal perfection as their highest of goals - not the "best in show" awards.

When one receives this "ribbon" one should be proud, because as, I think it was Tim said, it is recognition from your peers. There is nothing the matter with recognition. If you become too lofty, I think your art will be come a reflection of that! Humbleness is a virtue and to want to do your best is I believe a virtue too - but it is what you do with it.

Which brings me to my second thought. Some can view "religion" as an expression of "faith". Art is most definitely an expression of creativity. Art and religion are like bread and butter because our history would not exist without either.

Art was the camera that took the pictures of all religions. The artists' creativity expressed their faith.

We go from the Sistine Chapel to a painting of Mary with cow dung flung at it. Is it art? Is it creative expression? Is it religious expression? Does it deserve "best in show"? Who the heck was this artist's teacher? Who is best suited to judge this piece of "art"?

[Lon Haverly]

That's all I have to say onthe subject. Y'all have the last word. Thanks for your contributions.

[Jim Riley]

I apologize, Marvin, for my slipup. No slight was intended. I will use Marvin from now on.

I couldn't help but think how appropriate your quote (below) would be if you simply substituted the word religion with art.

If we were debating religion my point of view would be that religion fails when it disregards the principle that we are all one coming from unity and balance. Any religion that preaches their tenants are superior, fails to grasp the concept that everything was created by the same source, and thereby promotes disharmony.

We have drifted, Cynthia, from the original question in part, I believe, because of suggestions implying control of the art shows by those otherwise described as "evil". I thought the gospels (whoever's) taught love and redemption for all (including sinners). But finding truth in art or religion apparently can result in condemnation if it does not match individual beliefs. It seems that you are free to believe in Eastern religion or Jackson Pollack but you will/should be ****ed if you practice it. I believe the discussion digresses but think it's in keeping with the definition of the Caf

[Mary Reilly]

I agree with Jim Riley, that this discussion is in keeping with the definition of the Caf

[Michele Rushworth]

I think Andy Warhol gave the best definition I have ever heard about what is and isn't "art".

He said, "Art is whatever you can get away with."

One thing's for sure: he himself was the living embodiment of that idea.

[Lon Haverly]

I can't resist a further comment. Mary, you are right, I agree in that context.

Michelle, your point is well taken, too. That is why art is so different than faith, in my view. Faith is not "whatever you can get away with." My faith has some very very specific definitions, unlike art. My faith is totally defined and expressed in the person of Jesus, made real in our lives and revealed by the Holy Spirit.

However, I am tolerant of other people's faith, and art. That is what I love about America. All faiths can thrive here, and are protected. All Christians are not part of the KKK, as you insinuated by your burning cross comment, Jim.

And speaking of judges, I don't condemn as "evil" other art forms. I don't condemn people who are not believers, either. It is not my Gospel, and I am not the Judge.

If anyone wants to continue this discussion in some other venue, you are welcome to private message me. I am happy to discuss my faith or yours on-line, or off-line if the moderator prefers.