Cadmium free and loving it.

[Marvin Mattelson]

I judge each painting based on its inherent beauty. Just because I may not agree that the way a painting is created is the best approach for me or my students to follow, I can still have great respect or admiration for the artist who created it.

Not using cadmiums in flesh mixtures works for me and has produced fantastic transformations for the vast majority of my students. I often refer to my students in my posts because I want to emphasize that I don't offer up any information that hasn't been battle tested, first by me and then by them.

Having a continuing group of students gives me the opportunity to see where problems can arise and this motivates me to try to invent or discover solutions. So what I do and what I teach is an ever evolving process based on producing results. If I discover a better way, then everything I teach goes right out the window. I am results oriented. My only allegiance is to the production of the finest paintings within one's ability.

If someone could show me that by using day-glo green I could achieve better results, I'd be teaching my students the Mattelson Day-Glo palette tomorrow.

Once people have control over what they do, they can incorporate whatever colors they see fit. I feel that my method gives the greatest number of people the best chance to successfully paint lifelike complexions. In addition I don't intend to create an army of Mini-Mattelsons. I'm sure all will agree one is more than enough. Therefore I encourage each student to express themselves fully. Understanding the broad principles that govern painting only serves to enhance individual creativity.

[Carl Toboika]

Having spent some time with Marvin, I have found him very open and supportive of each individual

[Marvin Mattelson]

Thanks Carl, it looks like the brainwashing took.

[Carl Toboika]

HAH! Oh, good! May I have that scrap of food now master?

Seriously, as Marvin full well knows , if I didn't feel as per my post about his palette, I'd say so in a heartbeat, or at the very least, say nothing.

[Tom Edgerton]

Boys, BOYS!

We all see the value of an honest debate about materials and methods, even a spirited one, and welcome it. That often creates the opportunity to learn about another's approach. I think the objection here is when the discussion is a thinly veiled excuse for personal attack. None of us here is so dumb that we can't perceive the difference.

Speaking for myself, I find it extremely tiresome to wade through three pages of essentially "Nyah, nyah, nyah!" to reach a small kernel of usable information. So again, I think we all know the difference between a passionate discussion of technique and materials and saying, "If you use THIS color, I have serious problems with your mother." I find the former illuminating, the latter boring.

To Marvin's defense, I think he gets a bad rap in this forum for being merely opinionated. In his workshop, he wasn't oppressively militant about his palette vs. another, and didn't require that we use it. But he's very outspoken about how useful it's been for him, and why, and that it might be so for us. A position about which I find nothing offensive, as it springs from personal experience. In his posts here, he says nothing in regard to the character of those who use brilliant cads, or other palettes. He's also never asserted that his palette is a groundbreaking Mattelson innovation, merely his personal refinement of what's come before from Paxton and Reilly. I see no self-aggrandizement or ego there.

To me, the finest paintings have a tension or interplay between passages of brilliant color and more muted tones. From lesser hands, paintings veer wildly between either screaming, oversaturated hues or dishwater-dull tones. But in the hands of an artist, every modulation and nuance imaginable is skillfully played off the others. Sargent was a master of the brilliant color notes, but also the most sumptuous grays and off-whites you'll likely ever see. Knowledge of the actual components of his palette, though interesting and worthwhile, won't make us Sargent.

The palette either assists or it thwarts, but it has no implied value in and of itself. And the choice of its components says nothing about the artist one way or the other. What matters is the result.

Peace--TE

[Richard Budig]

Goodness. I certainly hope that I have not said anything that sounds like sniping. I find it fascinating to read about the colors other artists use.

After reading Marvin's list of colors, and his thoughts on red, I dug out some old tubds of Venetian and Indian Reds, and playe with them all one morning. I was fascinated by how closely I could approximate the very colors I get with my cad red light, which, because of its sharp nature, I find necessary to cut with something like raw umber, cobalt, viridian, etc. Made me think that I'll add some Venitian (it's warmer than Indian) to my palette since it automatically mixes NOT SO HOT as does cad red.

[Marvin Mattelson]

Richard,

I don't believe that Tom was referring to you. He was referring to people who, rather than joining into the discussion and sharing their own insights based on their experiences, as you have, try to attack the validity or the character of the person posting.

I would show you an example of this but to the best of my knowledge those offending posts have been removed. The fact that your posts remain intact speaks volumes.

Being that this is indeed a forum, debate and discussion of different points of view should be embraced and considered for their own merits. We can then accept, reject or question what we read and respond if we wiish.

We as artists are very passionate, by nature, about our beliefs and well we should be. However it is easy to get drawn into things too far, however, so we all need to count to ten, evaluate the content of what we say and review it's intended purpose in order to make sure we aren't debasing others.

I too have succumbed at times, usually in responding to an attack from another, but overall I have really tried to avoid being sucked into less than gentlemanly behavior.

Umfortunately some never seem to learn their lessons and so their words, like stones, have been cast aside.

[Chris Saper]

Admin note: The posts in this thread have veered far from the Cadmium-free palette. Please keep your posts on topic.

[Marvin Mattelson]

Chris,

I am putting forth great effort in the attempt at being well behaved. My second grade teacher warned my mother about this. Now you want me to stay on topic as well? My linear right brained orientation makes this a near impossibility, you know. But I wiil try.

Shouldn't their be some sort of exemption for the thread starter, however?

[Cynthia Daniel]

Everyone should take note of my new conduct warning post in the Posting Guidelines & Proper Conduct section.

http://forum.portraitartist.com/show...&threadid=3774