Say it right

[Leopoldo Benavidez]

I always thought is was "ker-ezs-scue-roe"

Tim,

Spanish I have a handle on, and Italian is not too far off, with many words that are very similiar, but starting this off with a ker sounds like your beginning post and statement

"There are several artist that get mispronounced so often that I'm no longer sure of myself"

Tim, it is most accurately, key-ah!

L

[Steven Sweeney]

Steve Martin used to have a similar problem ("Cheese is 'fromage'. Egg is 'oeuf'. It's like those French have a DIFFERENT word for EVERYTHING!)

Pity the shy persons of the world who only want a 'venti' size latte and a tuna 'focaccia', but just can't risk the hazard of choking on those words.

(How do you say 'venti', anyway, and what would you do with a quart of coffee?)

I've just reviewed a super still-life video from the very "painterly" Gregg Kreutz (both the video and his book, "Problem Solving for Oil Painters", are incredible), and his pronunciation of "chiaroscuro" (there's another "r" between the "a" and the first "o") accords with Leo's.

It is my recollection from some traumatic French study a long time ago that indeed the "u" after the "g" in Bouguereau gives it a hard "g" sound. The confusion is likely due to frequent misspellings omitting the "u".

I believe, too, that Henri threw his hands up in frustration and went by the name "Hank" during the latter part of his career.

[Timothy C. Tyler]

Yes, but Hank was pronounced "hunk"- so it never ends.

[Leslie Ficcaglia]

Would not Michael be pronounced with a hard "c" when spelled that way, but in the French manner when spelled "Michel"?

As a former French major, I tend to pronounce French words correctly when speaking English, but leave out or minimize the French accent to avoid sounding too pretentious.

[Michael Fournier]

Yes, Leslie I know that. It's a long story, but it involves the US Army, and the fact that once entered on an official US Government document, it seems to take an act of Congress to correct. Also, no one seemed to get that Michel was a boy's name pronounced as Michelle, they just thought I spelled it wrong and changed it back, or called me Michael (with a hard c) anyway. That is how it got to Michael. But I don't mind so much to be called Michael with a hard c, but I hate the way my last name sounds when Americanized, especially when they hang on the r and pronounce it like Four-ni-errrr.

Besides, Michael is from St. Michael, and heck, who knows, I could use a saint watching over me from time to time.

[Steven Sweeney]

Yes, but Hank was pronounced "hunk" - so it never ends.

I'd thought it best not to mention this earlier, but it's actually worse than you think, Tim. At the time of the name change, he had enjoyed several servings of an imported beer popular in the U.S., and he adapted its name, thus creating a "Haanke" spelling. Thereafter debate raged as to whether he was "Honk" or "Honk-eh". Indeed it never does end.

(Not in this Forum, anyway!)

[Michael Fournier]

As a former French major, I tend to pronounce French words correctly when speaking English, but leave out or minimize the French accent to avoid sounding too pretentious.

Yes, you're right. But unless your French is very good (and mine is not) when you speak to a Frenchman/woman, they always correct you unless you use the correct accent. Always trying to be helpful of course.

Even simple conversation can be a problem. Goes like this: I say "allons mangent" (Let's go eat) then they repeat it. And I say "Est-ce ce que j'ai dit" (this is what I said) then they say "Oh aucun vous pas" (oh no, you didn't). It usually ends in me saying it in English or I starve and spend the rest of the evening working on my French. I also have problems with plural vs. singular and tense. Example: "all

[Juan Martinez]

Dear All,

I love exercises like this - attempting to transcribe correct sounds using words and phonetics that are understood by everyone. So, allow me to wade in with some confirmation on the pronunciations of things suggested thus far. (For what it's worth, besides English, I speak and read Spanish well, and I speak and read both Italian and French well enough to get me into trouble.)

Bouguereau: the hard "g" is correct. Boo-geh (as in "get")-roh. Chris's explanation was comprehensive. French is officially unaccented, so each syllable gets equal emphasis.

chiaroscuro: hard "c". kya-ro-SKOO-ro. In Italian, a "c" followed by an "i" or an "e" is normally soft and sounds like our "ch" in "church". But, when followed first by an "h" it makes it a hard "c". Otherwise, since they don't use the "k", there is no way to write the hard "c" sound prior to an "i" or "e". By the way, for those who wish to know, the literal translation of chiaroscuro is "lightdark".

Robert Henri: I've always heard it pronounced Hen-rye, too. But, I have no knowledge as to why this is so. The reasons put forth sound good to me.

Here's a few other ones of interest to - well - me:

Imprimitura: eem-pree-mee-TOO-rah. Just as many seem to get this wrong as they do right, perhaps even more. It is frequently misspelt as imprimatura. That middle "a" should be an "i". The plural is imprimiture (eem-pree-mee-TOO-ray). Using the "ray" for the Italian long "e" is not quite precise, but it's the closest we can come in English writing.

Giotto, Giambattista, Ghiberti
In Italian, the "g" follows similar rules as does the "c". That is, a "g" followed by an "i" or "e" is soft and pronouced like the "g" in the English "gel". However, when you want a soft "g" before an "o" or an "a", which isn't normally possible, you must insert an "i" which is more-or-less silent. Thus Giotto is NOT Gee (as in "gee-whiz")-otto, but rather Jotto. (Linger on the double "t" just a split second longer, will ya?) And, Giambattista is Jambattista, as in jambalaya. To make a hard "g" before an "i" or "e", in Italian you insert an "h". So, Ghiberti sounds like Gee (like the "gi" in Yogi) -BEAR (again, as in "Yogi the--") -tee.

And here's two more for all of you fun-loving pedantics out there: it's broo-SKET-tah, not broo-SHEHdah for bruschetta. The "h" makes for a hard "c". As strange as it may sound to the non-Italian waiter in your local non-Italian Trattoria, it is correct. And, oh yes, it's trat-tor-REE-ah, not tra-TOR-eeyah.

Now, let's get back to work.

All the best,

Juan

[Leslie Ficcaglia]

Michael (Michel?), there's also a very significant difference between Canadian and Parisian French; we have a lot of Canadians vacationing down here at the shore so we often hear the former, and our sailing club at a nearby lake has a lot of French members who have come over, with their families, as executives in the local glass companies. The French are quite disdainful of Canadian French, being such purists, as you suggest! I once worked with a French fellow and tried to practice on him, and of course he couldn't tolerate it. The French people at the sailing club are fine about it but we rapidly lapse back to English because my conversational French is so rusty.

We had a French adolescent staying with us for a month when my kids were young teenagers and it was a nightmare. The kid was a real behavior problem, put salt in a cake I was making, and broke both our toilets, but because he refused to speak English (which was supposed to be the point of the cultural exchange, of course) my French really got good for that period. I've always had a good accent - which doesn't mean I always know how to pronounce the words. But a high point was the time that a French guest of one of our resident French colony came paddling up to me at the lake and asked, "Quelle heure est-il?" and after I told him the correct time in French he asked what part of France I hailed from. Wow! I could rest on those laurels for a long time... Another time I was sitting in a group of local French people , following their conversation and making occasional comments, when one of the women suddenly looked at me in surprise and said in French, "But you're speaking French!" I don't think she had realized before that that I could, so that was fun, although the attitude was almost akin to the amazement that would be engendered by suddenly realizing that a dog was addressing you in human speech. Still, I certainly couldn't sustain it for any length without lots more practice.

Otherwise the French seem determined to shame us into speaking English because we can't possibly approach their standards. Seems to be your experience, non?

[Mari DeRuntz]

...from a chef, heartfelt thanks for educating the artistic masses regarding bruschetta. Now if you could just get the gringos to make it correctly - char bread, rub with clove of raw garlic, drizzle with good olive oil.

Question:
How do you pronounce "Steinke" (Bettina Steinke)?