Approaching the client

Patt Legg · 07-21-2003, 11:06 PM

I received a phone call tonight from someone who is wanting a portrait of himself (possibly wife too, but a separate one later). We will be meeting soon. He feels that he wants a traditional one (frontal head and shoulders) but will leave it up to me. I prefer three quarter view.

I would like to include his hands in it, but do not want to make the size too large where he will not agree. Thought about suggesting an 18x24 or 20x24. What is best for just below waist or with hands?

The other question is really the real reason I am writing. He thinks he wants him only with a separate one later of his wife. I usually suggest such a set-up due to the clients' having children and later they could each have a painting of their parents.

But then, daughter may want Dad too and not just Mom (just a "for instance"). If I suggest doing them both together, what other option would you all suggest to say to him to make sense of this? I guess I am putting myself in their shoes and would figure the children would bicker over it later. What do you think? Not my problem, right?

One note to you on the Forum only-----I would personally love to do them both for the practice and I am partial to that. Also, I suppose if I am honest with you, he may change his mind (money wise) and not do hers later. Is that a silly worry?

Please send info soon so I may meet with him and have a definite place in which to start.

Michele Rushworth · 07-22-2003, 12:15 AM

It's impossible to predict what might happen down the road with any client. Will they get the second portrait they've been thinking of? Which child will want to keep the painting of which parent? Who knows!

I would do the painting he wants now and worry about the future issues when they come up. If you prefer to paint the husband and wife both together now you may want to offer a discount, if price is the issue for him on this. I have offered my clients a better price on a full length pose when they felt they could only afford a three-quarter, for example. I wanted the full length for my portfolio and felt it was a much better composition.

I often have clients who are trying to decide between a portrait of their two kids together or separate paintings. I tell them that when they are in the same painting you are depicting the relationship. When they are separate you are depicting an individual and can arrange the painting to suit each individual's personality.

I would think that a three-quarter angle of a subject in a head-and-shoulders composition would be much more interesting than a straight on view. Having a subject's head turned at an angle to their shoulders is often a good idea too.

As to size it depends on the size you like to work. I prefer to work three-quarter to life size and that pretty much determines the size of the canvas. I price by how much of the figure is included, though, not by the size of the canvas.

Tom Edgerton · 07-22-2003, 08:59 PM

Pat-

I agree with Michele--you can't predict what will happen down the road.

Another consideration, if it is your practice to discount multiple subjects on the same canvas, is that if they buy separate portraits you'll make more than if you put them both in one painting.

If he wants himself alone now, one way you might be able to influence them to follow through is to offer a discount on the second painting if they sign an agreement now to do both--one painting now and one later. For example, offer the second painting at 10% or 20% less than full price (at most). But don't discount the second painting by as much as you would if you painted both on the same canvas.

Offering it this way may help "lock in" the second painting, even if it is painted later.

Best--TE

Michele Rushworth · 07-22-2003, 10:20 PM

I've found that signed agreements don't count for much, unless you want to bring a lawsuit to enforce them. I've had two separate clients in the past six months back out of signed agreements (including one client asking for their deposit back), due to the economy.

Fortunately, I hadn't started work on either painting. I didn't put up a fuss because I'd like these people to become my clients at some point down the road and I wanted to leave things on a good footing.

If I were you I'd just make arrangements that suit you and the client best for right now and worry about future possible portraits as they arise.

Tom Edgerton · 07-25-2003, 08:32 AM

Michele--

I agree that if it really comes down to it, you'll have a hard time making a commission agreement for future work stick, "legally." Most times common sense will guide one in client relations on this point.

For purposes of clarification, though, I hope you're not suggesting discarding commission agreements entirely, as I feel at the point actual work begins, they're absolutely essential in documenting the parameters of the project between artist and client.

A word of mouth agreement is too subject to "selective memory" later.

Best regards--TE

Michele Rushworth · 07-28-2003, 05:13 PM

Tom, sounds like you and I are on the same page. I always have written contractual agreements with clients for current commissions, as well as any commission that has been officialy put in my future schedule (usually secured with a deposit, also).

They do sometimes fall through, though, and in my limited experience, the ones farther out in the future seem to be the riskiest.