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-   -   What do you think? (http://portraitartistforum.com/showthread.php?t=269)

Michael Fournier 12-06-2001 08:57 PM

What do you think?
 
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I thought I might enter the lion's den so to speak and upload a image for critique.
When I started this it had more life; it seems to have lost something as it got tighter.

Cynthia Daniel 12-07-2001 01:03 AM

Michael,

Very pretty! I like it. You captured a great sensitivity in the face and eyes. I think the thing that jumped out at me was the the jaw and chin area; perhaps too sharp or is it too light against the dark shadow of the neck? I'm sure one of the artists will be able to put it into words better.

You didn't happen to photograph it at the earlier stage did you?

Jim Beutler 12-07-2001 02:38 AM

Hi Michael,

One of the predominant casualties when a painting "gets tight" are the edges. This is a particular danger, among many, when depending too much upon photographic references. Try varying them to a much greater extent. As Cynthia pointed out, the area in which all the sharp edges first grab my eye is the jawline. Try softening the edge of the dark side of the face, loosing it into the hair. Carry this idea farther throughout the entire composition, e.g. blend the hair on the dark side of the head into the chair, and (parts of) the top edge of the chair into the background.

One tip which may help U 2 choose edges 2 soften is 2 think of "selective focus". When U're looking at the subject, most likely focusing upon her eyes, what aren't U focusing your eyes sharply upon? By thinking in this way, U can guide the eyes of the viewer of the painting in a manner similar to that in which your perception was guided when U decided 2 paint this woman.

"Lost and Found" edges are one of the most exciting differences between photography and painting. If U haven't yet, treat yourself to the pictures in any book by Richard Schmid. Enjoy!

David Dowbyhuz 12-07-2001 10:19 AM

Your work IS very solid and appealing, Michael, but I know what Cynthia's saying. One of the true pitfalls of working from photos (of which I am a rabid advocate).

What do you think of this tampering?

Maxine Gilder 12-07-2001 09:54 PM

I think it really helped alot. The softer edges on the jaw. Another thing that bothers me is the continuous space at the top that draws my attention up instead of where it should be.

I really like the painting otherwise. The model intrigues me because she seems to want to jump out of the chair! I really like that because it evokes an emotional response! :)

Cynthia Daniel 12-07-2001 10:12 PM

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I thought I'd try my hand at it. I did the following:

1. cropped the top
2. softened the edge all around her face
3. softened the highlight on her chin and nose
4. darkened the right side of her face
5. lightened her left eye a bit

I think it's a softer look. What do you think?

Overall, you have a winner of a portrait!

Michael Fournier 12-10-2001 12:04 AM

Hi Everyone,

I have made some changes and I like the how it looks I still am not done but when I am it will be up on my web site.

I will post to let you all know when it is up.
there will be a larger version on my site so that you can all see how much your advice helped.

Thanks

Darla Dixon 12-11-2001 07:30 PM

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I think sometimes it's a matter of layout or cropping to make it more powerful...?

Michael, I hope you don't mind I took the liberty of saving your art and then 'fiddling' with it in my Paint Shop Pro program.

I sharpened it and cropped it.

The subject's right arm (on viewer's left) and the wide open space at the top of the portrait bothered me. The arm area was suddenly dark, and the upper area was very light...I wonder if you don't crop the picture if making the background above the red chair darker would help.

Just wanted to let you see it a different way.

Her eyes and face are quite powerful. I like it.

Cynthia Daniel 12-11-2001 11:47 PM

Darla,

The sharpening definitely makes the subject's beautiful blue eyes pop out more. However, the wavy lines that now exist in her face is an indication of image degration due to oversharpening.

Also, regarding sharpness of edges in art, there's a subject called "lost and found" edges, of which I'm not an expert, but I've found the following two references on the internet regarding the subject and which I think is relevant here. It's actually a subject I've been hoping someone would write an indepth article about for the forum:

Reference from http://innovativart.com/paintinfo3.html:
  • Varying the occurrence of hard and soft edges can be not only aesthetically pleasing, but also seem to solve a lot of problems that seem to be related to color or drawing.

    Lost and found edges or hard and soft edges are ways to think in terms of. Beginning edges are hard (those that face the light and are struck by the light) and turning edges are soft, in general.

    Hard and soft, lost and found, ebb and flow... This constant sense of pulsating, rhythmic change is needed to impart vitality to a painting.
Reference from http://www.artworkshops.ca/articles/figurep.html:[list]An outline identifies a shape but ignores everything else except the outer shape of the subject, i.e. an outline of a head tells us nothing about the person

Darla Dixon 12-11-2001 11:59 PM

Yes I agree Cynthia, and sorry, I hadn't realized you had already cropped the top area. The top area was a real problem for me visually. I almost feel like a dark hunter green color would be fantastic for the background to set her off.


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