Bargue Plate 5
 

For anyone who didn't catch the previous thread, Mischa has very generously offered to walk me (and anyone else who wants to join in) through a Bargue drawing.

Mischa, I've checked your list of tools and have everything bar the #2 Da Vinci synthetic brush. I don't think the local art shop has them, so if you can tell me the characteristics I should be able to get something near. Failing that, I can always order one I guess.

For everyone else, here's Mischa's Bargue drawing toolkit reproduced from the other thread:

Without further ado, here's the plate ready to go. This is a full size reproduction, printed on a dye sublimation printer. It does a good job of reproducing the nuances of tone in the original. Let me know if you want me to change anything before we start. The picture was unfortunately taken in failing light.

Thanks for offering to do this Mischa, it's very much appreciated. I'll try to be a good student :)

Paul, thank you for accepting my suggestion. The work will be difficult and sometimes my requests difficult to follow but I am sure you will do your best. I will at times push you beyond your best but this will benefit you. So, please be patient with me and we will get through this.

Ok, let us start. First we will think where to place the drawing on the blank canson. So we must adjust the copy and the blank accordingly, side by side. It is good that you have posted all three drawings. The other two drawings are just but a guide in regard to the procedure but all measurements are to be taken from the original (the copy).

After we have envisioned where the drawing will be placed we need to draw a vertical plumb line on the blank paper but before you do that take a red string and figure out where the best place for a plumb line would be and tape it on the copy. You will make all your measurements from the plumb line and transfer them to the drawing. You can do this by eye if you wish but check it with a string held between thumbs. Do not use a tape measure. Use a straight edge just to make the plumb lines.

After the plumb line is drawn we need to establish and mark parallel vertical top and bottom measurements on the blank paper. Then we go towards mapping out all other measurements. Be precise, even a thin pencil width when off is not good enough. Do not use a ruler to measure rather use a peace of string between thumbs.

Always double check your measurements at least from three different points.

Make all lines light and thin with a needle point 2B pencil. The needle point should be long, this saves time and the the point stays sharp longer. Have a number of pencils ready to replace the dull ones.

Please do not go beyond mapping and lightly drawing all the lines. If you draw it in to dark and you need to move it than you will have undesirable marks in your finished drawing.

Wish you good speed. (speed is good but accuracy is better)

That's very instructive.

My 2 cents... I use binder clips to fix my papers on my board.

Binder clips are good and I use them as well, same kind. For this type of drawing the the paper that we will be working on and the copy must not move. They are to stay side by side or one above the other until the drawing is finished. So, I recommend ordinary paper tape.

Brush
 

A small (#2) cheap synthetic brush will do the trick.

Thanks Micha for taking the time to explain
ilaria

Ilaria, no thank you. This is but a small contribution for the members of this forum a forum that has given me much.

This is very interesting and I'm looking forward to seeing how this process will unfold!

Michele, I too am looking forward to see how this progresses. For me it is not just about giving instructions, the same must be clear and easy to follow. So, I hope to see image posts, from the forum, so we do not go of track.


If anyone is thinking of using tracing paper to check their progress DON'T. This will be defeating the purpose and one will lose more that gain. There is more to learn here then getting the lines right. Just taking three points of measurement is a lesson and a good habit to get into. Why? Later when you work on a live person this tree point practice will come in handy. You have no idea how much.
If you have everything setup do post a image of the setup. This will help you and me to get of to a good start. This will be difficult as it is, so lets check the setup.

All the best

Mischa, that's interesting you don't recommend using tracings to check. The book recommends it, I tried it on my last ears from plate 4 (after I'd finished them, not during, I think that's important) and found it quite instructive because it showed me how out I could be yet still think it was right to my eye - in short, how much eye training I still have to do.

I'm not arguing, I'm going to follow your instructions to the letter on this, just curious why you'd recommend not doing it?

By the way, had to work late last night so couldn't get started. Hopefully this evening.

>
> My reasoning is this.When drawing from life, like the cast or live model, we will not have a tracing paper to use. It is best not to use it now rather push one self, our mind, our eye to see the mistakes. Measuring with a string should be enough to meashure and check. Can you see the beniffit? In the next category of exercises, there wont be a actual taped down plumb line, on the copy, all the time, to work from, only a imaginery plumb line. A plimb line that one will place visualise the point from which to measure and measure.
As for the tracing paper exercise. This principle can be used for shape exercises. Draw a shape, simple at first, then attempt to reproduce it perfectly. Give your self three checks with a tracing paper. The ear exercises, and such, can be used but it is better to draw shapes of sort. This way you are not atemting to make something look like a ear or an eye rather to make it exactly like the shape.

Hi Mischa,

Sorry for the delay, life has been a bit busy.

I've changed the set up now, sliced off the top schematic so I can move it up the drawing board, taped down the plumb line (I thought it sensible to use the vertical supplied) and drawn a corresponding vertical on my paper. I've checked that the board is level with a spirit level.

The plan is to give this about two hours per night, so it may take a little while. I'll give it more if I can find the time. Here's a pic of the current set up, hope you approve:

I visited your web page and saw that you have a lot of different art projects in the works. I have also noticed a lot of improvement especially in the last while. Your charcoal value studies are excellent and your one color studies are up there as well.

As for the Bargue exercises they are amassing teachers if only they are executed correctly. Many artists of today even some academy trained artists still have not fully grasped the value of th Bargue plates. I will give you a hint. The extent and the benefit you will understand if you complete the exercises properly. Four plates, that is all, and your minds eye will see thing you never thought possible.

Your set up looks good. Start of first by marking the top of the fut and the bottom. I stress the importance of these first marks to be level with the original copy. Why? Because later on when you glance back and forth from drawing to the copy this will help you to see if you are of or not. If the alignment is off, in the setup, then your mind needs to adjust in order for you to see your mistakes. I think you know this but for the benefit of others I have tried to explain the importance.

Good speed but precision is better.

Thanks Mischa, that's very encouraging to hear. The Bargue drawings I've done so far have undoubtedly taught me much already, I'm hoping this thread will help me to get to the next level with them. Thanks again for being so generous with your time.

Just so I'm clear - are these first top and bottom points drawn across say with a ruler and a spirit level, to make sure that they are absolutely accurate, or do I do them with the sight-size method using the string?

I find I can get accurate to within about an eighth of an inch with the string, sometimes closer, but rarely absolutely accurate. I'm generally standing about 6 - 8 feet back from the easel when I measure with the string. I know that the rest of the drawing will be done with a combination of string and judging by eye, I just want to make sure I get this first part right.

The red string
 

For now, get the marks accurate the best you know how.

As for how to further transfer measurements. At this stage it is not done at a distance. Most of the work you will do seated. When you start refining you will look from a distance. This said, you will measure with a string wrapped around forefinger of left hand and forefinger of right hand using the thumbs as a slide and the nail on the thumbs as the measuring edge. Here is a photo to help explain. Think of the tape as a finger nail on the left and finger nail on the right hand.

I am wondering if anyone else, besides Paul, has started the Bargue study and how far along has one got?

Some would think that having the Bargue book and reeding the instructions without actually using the plates will be sufficient to implement the principles and understand the procedure within a self induced project.

When I first arrived at the Angel Academy and was introduced to the same plates, I thought to self that the four plate requirement in pencil would be a breeze to do and that I would have them out of the way within a week or two. I was wrong. Three took 12 days each and the fourth 20 days. Approximate number of hours worked on each was 4 hrs a day.

The first one the foot the simplest to do was the toughest for me. Each one after presented a different challenge but what a delight when completed. After finishing the four plates I realized I was barely at the start of understanding what came next and that was working from the cast in charcoal. After finishing the first cast, the face of Michelangelo's David, it was but then that my minds eye was illuminated. The next challenges difficult to do but pure pleasure. In my arsenal I had the understanding and this understanding made the clime up easy.

Remember the three little pigs and the wolf, I'm sure we all do. Taking a short cut in ones studies will result in?

I have learn't and am still a student, that art that will stand the test of time is not just a line in pencil or charcoal but a line precisely executed, it is not value shadow or light rather it is the same precisely executed, it is not color or hue warm and cool rather precisely executed. If these and other elements that are a sum of a Valasques, Bouguereau, Cassatt, Sargent etc are not understood properly it will not stand the test.

A Bargue executed in pencil first will give one the tools needed in order to properly understand charcoal. Another thing, it will most assuredly speed up the learning process. If you do not believe me ask anyone that has followed this procedure. If you still do not believe me then ask the many professionals of today about the struggles that they have in reaching their individual goal of excellence. Then again it all boils down to what one's goal is.

I hope that my words wont be misunderstood. I am not promoting a particular school but rather am sharing with the members of this forum my understanding of the matter, from personal experience.

A sincere, All the best, whatever path one takes.

Dear Mischa and Paul

I have tried a couple of the Bargue plates a couple of times but have found my concentration goes all too quickly. I can only manage about 20 minute sessions before I get bored or distracted.

I lost my job two weeks ago and am re-arranging my art space to start doing the plates again. I have attached Plate 1-14 and 60 that I have completed but am going to go back and start from Plate 1-4 where I left off from last time.

I have already noticed a big change in 'seeing' and expect to 'see' more when I 'do' more Bargue. I am also fighting with my inability to concentrate which causes me to lose faith in finishing all of the exercises. I know if I can complete more I will learn more. I just get so bored with the slowness of it all.

Ngaire, I apologize for not responding sooner and blaming this or that is not what I wish to do. I am at fault.

Your drawing of plate 1,14 is looking good. There are some concerns and one is that you mite be rushing the learning process. Don't fret this is a common mistake that most make and that is rushing to get to the finish. Each drawing is set up to teach a student curtain steps that are essential for eye and value development. If the steps are followed correctly the reward will be there.

In your plate 1,14 the line drawing could have been taken to a more accurate level before the introduction of value. Certainly you have a good drawing but you have not reaped the full benefit. For example some measurements look to be off which you can easily check. Then the line variation needs some adjusting checking for areas where the line is straight in relation to where there is a dip or a slight curve. Is curved line convex or concave. Then the shadow value must be a flat solid dark dark at a appropriate value. The halftoan is to be just that and in correct relation to the shadow and light making sure that it is accurate when compared to the original.

Sure this is tedious and boring in which case you need to find ways to motivate self. I remember when I was doing my first charcoal study. I got as far as the half ton stage and felt I could not budge another inch. It was my first experience with charcoal at this level of precision and I felt PAIN. Still, I got up of my chair and went to the paper with the idea to place but five dots on the paper. I ended up putting twenty. My biggest problem was not the work rather the understanding of how to make that charcoal do what I wanted it. When I got through that stage I was in place of bliss.

So, one must ask one self. What do I want? Do I want to just finish this exercise and get it over with or do I wish to get the benefit's that it offers. Each must decide for them self.

I wish you a good choice and acuracy

"It is better to be accurate than fast" Wild Bill Hickok

Mischa, thank you very much for your reply. I really do appreciate it. Yes I am sprung, I did rush it out of boredom.

I do find it difficult to stick with it, patience is a virtue, I realise, but I suppose my attention span got the better of me or was it self-discipline that was lacking.

I have restarted the plates with a different perspective and am on Plate 1-4 ears and have taken the position to slow down my evaluations to see better.

Self discipine is a big issue for me, any hints?

Ngaire, I believe that self discipline can be a tough one. If you nudge away at it and continue to push it out of your way you can beet it. After a time, you will be surprised for self discipline will not be a problem any more.

ok,so will confess I am also one of those who have kept the Bargue book in my bookshelf for quite some time. But thank you so much Mischa for this thread and your great help.And the good advices above.
, I have worked on this o plate 1,6 , and hopefully work them up to perfection. tsee what I can learn from it .
Up to now I learned :
1. never to trust the eye and always measure twice.
2.a millimeter off here and another there, makes everything out of place
3. curved lines are hard to copy and get in the right place.
4.not as easy as it might look to do these drawings :o

first layer of shading:

Grethe, I am glad that you have accepted my offer and are willing to go through the stages necessary to do this drawing. We are fortunate to have the Bargue plates even when on the shelf but the true benefit comes from practical understanding.

Your foot is coming along well. This stage where you are at now is a most important stage. Here is where you will fine tun all lines and shapes. When you think you have done that send the drawing to me for a final look. The next stage will be a pleasure to do and also the stage where you will see your drawing come to life.

All the best to you

Mischa, thank you , I appreciate your help very much.

Grethe, the pleasure is all mine. It is the people and that is why this forum is such a nice place. What kind of a world would this be if we did not care to help one another.

All the best to you and I am glad that the people on the forum were/are there for you.

When I was doing the Bargue drawings I found the first one to be the most difficult to do. Why? Everything is new and in life we rush at things. The ones that master an art, what ever that art may be, are the ones that tuck their time in the beginning in order to master the basics. Don't rush the finish. Refine the finish for as one gets close to the finish one can find a wealth of understanding in placing a dot here and not there, in line thickens and why.

We miss-out on so much when we rush and we come to the point when we must go back in order to learn what we have missed.

Misha,

How eloquently you have stated this thought!

Kind of you to say that Chris. Still, I cannot take the credit for the credit belongs to Jn.3:16. I am but a student. If I can instill but a chuckle, by the way I use or spell words, than I am happy.

Mischa, thank you for your support for students.

I started Plate 4 - ears some time ago and got to half way as my impatience annoyed me doing the curves. I am looking at it now and am going to have to fight with my procrastination, my ignorance and inabilities to strive to do these exercises the best I can at this present moment of my training.

It is funny how we don't think we need this sort of training in our heads we think we are so much better than we are, we certainly come down to earth with exercises like these that test your sight measuring and artistic abilities. I haven't gotten into the habit of standing back and measuring with an outstretched arm and brush yet as I thought my eye training (as limited as it is) would allow me to wing it. Oh, how I was oh so wrong in my assumptions and expectations.

From now on I have to take it one step at a time.