Photo Critique Request
 

Hi everyone,

I hope I attach this correctly since it took awhile for me to figure out how to attach my photo of myself - finally - after posting for several months!

I have drawn and painted my daughter several times and am getting ready to start on my first profile of her. It will be a 20x24 oil painting.

Any help or advice about this photo reference would be greatly appreciated. I love to take picture and click away so taking another roll isn't that much trouble for me. Of course, getting a teen to agree to the time I want to take the pics is a problem -- if any of you out there are familiar with teen girls that is, hehe.

Here it is I hope....

Try, try again....
 

Maybe this time it will go..... If not, I will contact Cynthia, the SOG wizard, for help.

I think this would make for a stunning painting. The single thing that immediately caught my eye was the intersection of the window frome with the front of her face. I can imagine trouble with that in the painting, if anything at all isn't quite right with the values or the perspective.

I played around in PhotoShop a little with this and tried having her higher, looking over the frame, and then I tried having the window raised, so she was looking out one of the smaller square panes. I wasn't taken by either.

It was interesting that the part of the frame nearest the face got so much lighter than the part nearer to us, and I assume that that's owing to reflected light from the lining of the curtain. Taking advantage of that light, I lightened that whole area immediately in front of her face, allowing the glow to almost eliminate any hard or dark edges near her face. The effect is easy to accept, because the light from outside is quite strong. This had the double advantage of getting the hard architecture away from her soft face, and making the glow from her face move out into the air in front of her, creating a space between her and the window. A triple advantage is that there's still the part of the frame nearer to us, which points the viewer's eye toward the girl, without driving down all the way to the face. Other parts of the frame also lead us to her, but aren't imposing themselves into an area as delicate as the facial features.

A beautiful subject and a great opportunity. I'm envious. Best of luck.

Thank you
 

Steven,

Thank you so much for taking time to critique this photo. I was pretty sure it would be a good source but the window - yes, it's a little problem.

I don't have Photoshop and usually play around with small sketches before I paint. I am moving the curtain so that it is behind her more, thus, eliminating the woodwork behind her which could get tedious and detract from her face. The top sill which reflects the light - I have decided to move it down somewhat and we'll see what happens there.

I am also thinking of making the curtain dark like the wall behind her. I usually paint pretty much true to the photo or the model and surroundings when they will pose for me, but this time I want the pose, but not the window framing behind her.

I will post this painting when I get far enough along that its time for a critique. I hope you will see it and give me some feedback. I read all your in depth posts and appreciate the time you give to help people like me on this Forum. I'm struggling to get to the point to take a commission. I'm building my portfolio - with portraits of my teen daughters, their friends and hopefully will be painting someone for a commission soon.

Yes, she is a good subject and I am learning how to paint her after about 5 subsequent paintings of her this past year. I'm not sure if getting a likeness is easier when you know the subject this well or harder?

Thank you again Steven.

Denise,

I think what the window had to give was the light. After it gave that, I don't think it has much appeal. One option would be to eliminate it all together and just have a classical dark background. Give a little touch of light on the edge of her right sleeve to seperate it from the background. Just one option to consider.

Hi Denise,

You've already gotten some good comments about composition etc., so I have only a couple things to add. Like you, when I work with a photo reference, I usually make pencil/charcoal drawings before I start to paint.

I noticed that in the photo your daughter has a slightly wide-eyed expression that almost suggests mild fear or surprise. This comes partly from the light catching the sclera (white) of the eye more than the more nasal portion, and partly from the elevation of the eyelid. When you're doing drawings you might play with the eyelid height and the value in the white to see how the likeness is affected. Sometimes the camera freezes the subject in a micro-gesture that's not really characteristic of what we perceive.

My other comment is that I really like the sweater/top with its colored embroidery. It's a fine complement to your daughter's fair hair and coloring.

Really looking forward to seeing how this one progresses!

Hi Denise,

I really like the photo, keep us posted on your progress.

At first I thought the embroidered shirt would date the portrait, but take a look here at Denise Racine

I have begun!
 

Mari,

The photo in person is much better as far as reading the mouth, as well as the color and outer line of her profile. It all looks fuzzy here - poor quality digital shot I guess. Her mouth is really very defined and from the profile is much easier to paint than the front view. I usually mess up everyone's nose and I enjoy painting/drawing profile noses - so much easier.

I also think the embroidered shirt will be very much simplified - it is one of those retro 70's shirts they are all wearing now. The shirts I wore when I was in college - but now they are all much differently colored.

Thank you so much for your attention. I will post after a few more days to get advice on the progress I have made. Thank you Mike, I am going to do just that, but I think I will put a little of the window in it. Since it's 24" x 30" I think I need something to have her doing on the viewer's left side since she is obviously gazing out the window or something like that. I want to make the outside very hazy-ish.

John,

Thanks for the comments and advice. I already have realized that eye has some strange things going on. I need to get her to pose for me in that same position when I get to it a little more detailed. Right now I am adjusting value, color and planes.

Any advice from anyone on getting this blonde color of hair would be much appreciated also. I sometimes get it too green in my attempts to not get it too yellow!

Thanks again for the help and look for it soon as a painting to continue to give this much need critique !

What a pretty daughter! You are lucky to have your own full time model!

I love the pose but I would be careful about making sure you know where the back of her silhouette stops. In other words, the line where her hair stops and the background starts. Remember Peggy's classes - A good silhouette is one of the most important elements.

Good luck with the embroidery, I know I had fun doing the brocade for "Andr

Window
 

She is your daughter, right? She is so beautiful! Her face shot is so gorgeous! So grab her and reshoot her with a medium to dark grey green background. Use Portra NC professional film with a reflector fill. The darker background will set off her hair. The geometrics of the window fight the graceful arabesques of her shirt design. Spending too much time in Photoshop can alter the sensitivity of the original shot and make it too mechanical. Just do it over again. It would probably take you less time in the long run. Don't work with material you are not perfectly happy with.

Background
 

Sharon,


I've already gotten into this painting too much to start over. I have already changed the curtain to a dark maroonish shade to blend with the dark wall. I did leave some of the window with a hazy yard below, much like the photo.

I am going to use the Portra film with a reflector on the shadow side from now on when I shoot for a portrait.


Thank you again for your advice!

Denise,

Beautiful girl. I especially like her long and elegant neck. I agree with Mike on this one. I would omit the window frame altogether. I think I would reshoot this with her standing further away from the window so that you get the light, but she is not so close to the window. It would also help if she didn't wear the fashionable light lipstick in future pictures. I think it will be easier to see the color of her mouth without the light lipstick and a more natural lip color will better stand the test of time.

Denise,

Sorry I didn't read your last post before I answered. As for the blond hair:
Mass in the hair shape with a mixture of white, yellow ochre, raw sienna and burnt umber. This is not the lightest color of the hair but a medium tone.

Make a mixture of alizarin crimson, a little thalo blue and a touch of burnt umber (a grayed violet) and paint in all the shadows.

Mix yelow ochre and white and paint in the lighter areas.

Mix alizarin crimson and white and a little cad yellow light in a very light value and stroke this highlight color on the already lightened areas.

Use some burnt umber for the dark accents.

For greenish yellow in the dark areas use cad yellow medium and burnt umber. For lighter gray areas with a greenish cast: ivory black and white and a little cad yellow light.

Remember that your background color is reflected in the hair. When dry, you may want to glaze a little of this color in a few places.

Hope this helps.

Digital pic of it?
 

I have the most muted Sony Mavica digital pic of this painting in progress from last weekend. I have painted on it since - it's further along now but, I feel like I should show it in that stage. The hair is barely started along with many other sketchy parts, even the curtain and wall wiped down from the original deep alizarin look.

I am having such a time getting a good jpeg, changing the size without losing sharpness. I don't own a better quality digital and am going to start taking more print film of my paintings to develop on disc for easier posting from now on. I really hate to post this painting as my first posted painting but feel like I would like to show it from start to finish.

I don't know whether to post it here or in the oil critique section...hmmmm??

I will definitely take a print film pic of it this weekend and have the film developed on disc to post.

I think it would help to show you how I have left the window partially in the painting with the dark curtain behind it. Also, Sharon, the curtain is not frilly at all, it is tailored very straightly - a muslin drape. (FYI only)

Denise,

When you save a file as jpg, there is an option to choose level of compression. If you save your file with less compression (higher quality), you should get better results. Also, you can run unsharp mask on the image after resizing it to bring back some of the crispness. Play with the unsharp mask to see what level gives you the best image.

Portra
 

Denise,

Just remember to get the right Portra, I believe I said NC.There is NR which is higher contrast and brighter. The first is better at skintones. Some tips:

A. Shoot and paint in natural day light.

B. Make sure if you are inside, (if at all possible) that green foliage is about 50' away. Outside use an IB filter it removes the greens.

C. Get the biggest color photo of the subject you can afford.

D. Place photo next to subject so you can grab the skin tones from the model. This helps because the photo is always in the same position. I find this technique especially useful on children.

An example of this is on my website www.portraitartist.com/knettell. It is the painting of a girl in a ballet skirt. The girl had a wonderful exuberant personality, she would sit still only very fleetingly. Working basicly from life with her I think I got an expression of barely contained glee. That would have been impossible using only a photo.

My caveat about 50' distance from foliage is well known among professionals. I had to learn it painfully. One of my first commissions was from life. The lady was beautiful, the portrait elegantly composed,the skintones tree color.

I'm always trying to learn, and I confess puzzlement over why you'd have an indoor set-up with foliage more than 50 feet away from you, and why, in any event, it would matter. You mentioned in your last sentence that you had a lot of green skin tones. But what's the connection?

Green faces
 

Ah Steven, where do I begin? Living in New England I am fortunate to have taken courses with, belong to a society with and sometimes schmooze with adherents of the Boston School. There are some wonderful books on the school on this very site. (Thank you Cynthia!)

They were a group of artists from Boston who studied classical painting techniques in Europe in the 19th century and brought them here. These techniques almost died out in America in the mid 20th century. A few stalwarts kept this small flame burning. So much knowledge was almost lost. One of them is the foliage thing. Simply put, skintones reflect any color that is near to them, adjacent walls, trees outside a window etc. Try this yourself, take a juicy blob of white paint place it next to window that is close to foliage and note the color change. That is why you have to have the clearest window possible. That is why north light is best, it is the steadiest and the most neutral. I paint a lot from life and I am always amazed how cameleon-like flesh is. I hope this is clear.

Green flesh
 

Steven, I forgot to add that I was painting the woman's portrait from life, next to a window with trees 6' away and she turned green at that distance.

Thanks, Sharon. I was mostly just trying to visualize the interior set-up you suggested. I wasn't sure why foliage 50 feet away was going to have much effect at all on flesh tones -- which I guess was precisely your point. I trained with one of Richard Lack's students, very much in the Boston School tradition, and I do recall the difficulty I had at first, accepting the possibility of greens in flesh tones, and then successfully seeing them in their subtle cool presence.

Jpegs and thanks
 

Hi everyone,

Finally able to get online - and reply to all your wonderful comments!

Cynthia, I am getting on this compression thing as we speak. Who knows what I may be able to accomplish?

I have taken pics today with my Nikon of the painting in progress, and will take it tomorrow and have a disc made so I can post it for a critique in the Oil critique section. I may have it online by tomorrow night if I get them developed as I plan to.

Thanks to all of you for the suggestions. I worked on the face some more this afternoon after I finally got home from a hard day at the office (classroom) and worked on the window sill, but not the curtain. Her hair is also in disarray but I'm going to post whatever I've got for a critique from you guys if you are still slightly interested.

I will go pour over your suggestions now and read the rest of what is going on in the portrait news today. I have some comments to make about the latest articles in a magazine but will post those in another section!

Take care and enjoy the weekend!

Green skin tones
 

Steven,

Yes, green skin tones are lovely when they are subtle, enhancing the pinks, oranges, reds, etc.. Too much, and your subjects look like Kermit. Exactly whoooo did you study with from the Lack Atelier? I don't take most of them very seriously (as well as a great deal of the Boston School fragments) because they are locked in the past and have not taken their knowledge into the 21st century. Most of them are doing boring pastiches of the past.

Discussion as to whether most of Lack's students and successors are doing boring work would stray too far from this thread's topic. Perhaps it will show up in the Cafe Guerbois area at some point.