Mike--

It'd be interesting to see the golden section applied to these last two genre pieces.

My guess is the heads (and the screen in the "Tea..") would hit somewhere just about there.

--TE

Tom,

I think I've got one represented below.

400w x 520h each multiplied by phi .618

The vertical blue line creates the first golden mean relationship from the horizontal perspective. The red line creates this relationship from the vertical perspective. The white line then creates two more rectangles from the golden section on the bottom right.

If my phiguring is correct I think that each of the phive resulting rectangles would be considered a golden section. It would seem that compositionally this painting would hold up pretty well in this regard.

Here's another that strikes a pretty good compositional balance.

Tom Edgerton's Superior Court Judge, 48 x 42.

Well, HEY!

I felt pretty good about the judge, but it's nice to know the Greeks would be proud too.

And a high phive to you, Mike, for all the effort!

--TE

I agree with Mike. Careful not to place any of todays concepts in yestrday's time frame, I believe that the size of the room shows opulence without shouting about it.

Not being familiar with the works and concious of the limits of photography I also trust that there is detail in the upper portions but it reproduces too dark to see.

WOW! I am late with the above comment and way to simple. Thanks Mike and Tom for the enlightenment.

Below are the paintings of John Everett Millais, 1829-1896, English Pre-Raphaelite painter and illustrator. Teacher of Frank Dicksee and president of the Royal Academy of Art - 1896.

1- Self Portrait
2- A Souvenir of Velasquez
3- My Second Sermon, watercolor 1864
4- Lord Alfred Tennyson

Ulysses
by Lord Alfred Tennyson (the last half)

There lies the port; the vessel puffs her sail;
There gloom the dark, broad seas. My mariners,
Souls that have toil'd, and wrought, and thought with me,--
That ever with a frolic welcome took
The thunder and the sunshine, and opposed
Free hearts, free foreheads,-- you and I are old;
Old age hath yet his honor and his toil.
Death closes all; but something ere the end,
Some work of noble note, may yet be done,
Not unbecoming men that strove with Gods.
The lights begin to twinkle from the rocks;
The long day wanes; the slow moon climbs; the deep
Moans round with many voices. Come, my friends.
'T is not too late to seek a newer world.
Push off, and sitting well in order smite
The sounding furrows; for my purpose holds
To sail beyond the sunset, and the baths
Of all the western stars, until I die.
It may be that the gulfs will wash us down;
It may be we shall touch the Happy Isles,
And see the great Achilles, whom we knew.
Tho' much is taken, much abides; and tho'
We are not now that strength which in old days
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are,--
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.

The paintings you have shared here, Mike, are inspirational indeed! Thank you!

Intersection or Quadrant?
 

Many times, we have basic questions that we are afraid to ask. Having taught children for 30 years, I did my best to eliminate that fear. The reason that I understood their concern is revealed below. I privately emailed Mike as I thought my question surely must be a VERY naive one and not wanting to appear as the "only one," I was sure tht the rest of the world OBVIOUSLY KNEW the answer and I didn't. While I didn't post my question for the whole world to read, Mike encouraged me to do so. All I can say is, "He better be right!!

Mike:
I have loved your composition thread! Loved it! Now, I am sending this question to you via private email as I am quite SURE that it is way to stupid to send on "The Phorum." The Golden Mean. I was under the impression that that perfect spot was where the lines intersect - something that has given me trouble when composing various paintings. What your lines indicate in the last several posts suggest is that the Golden Mean is the quadrant that their intersection creates. If that is correct, that makes composing a painting a whole lot easier.

I'll be thankful for your answer.
__________
Carol,

It's not a dumb question, especially the way I presented it. I first stated that there was a single point of interest, but later discovered that it is indeed a rectangular section, and possibly many sections. I sure wouldn't mind if you ask the question on the forum. I may not have cleared up these points sufficiently.

Mike

Carol,

What a dumb question! Ha, just kidding.

I think you've got it right. In all my research I've not been able to find anything that suggests that the "golden section, mean, ratio" can be reduced to a single point on the canvas. They are rectangular sections created in a specific way with the use of Phi or phi, and hold within them the main components, or points of interest within the composition.

You can do a google search on "golden section" and get a ream of information on the subject. Much of it is mathematical some of it relates to art specifically.

Sorry about the conphusion.